Is Thomas Wayne considered an antagonist in this film? The inside of a fridge is not only cold, but it is dark and relatively sound-proof. Just when he thinks he's caught up to them in an alleyway, they smash the sign over his face. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. "For instance, his relationship to Sophie is a fantasy to him. Why else do you think Randall gave Arthur a gun, snitched on him to his boss, and then asked what he had said to the cops. It's more likely that Arthur became overpowered with rage, when Randall began to discuss the police investigations, and forgot about the wine. Is this an origin story for the Heath Ledger Joker or is this the same Joker from the comics? Arthur killed the three bankers on impulse. His gait is confident, loose, and relaxed, and that is how he imagines himself. Also worth noting despite initially claiming to like Arthur, his boss clearly doesn't with the sign incident having him be prebiased against anything what Arthur says because he is inherently untrustworthy as a mental patient, not even Arthur's heavy bruises seemed to convince him. Edit, Arthur's therapy and medication are paid for by the city government. Arthur figured out that Randall set him down this path into madness and wronged him which is why he murders him out of vengeance. This movie took place a long time ago and people were not as knowledgeable on conditions like Arthur's Edit, Todd Phillips suggests that this isn't necessarily supposed to be the actual Batman-fighting Joker. Like much else in this movie, whether this is *THE* Joker's origin story or just *A* Joker's origin story is left to the audience to guess. Comments Fincher made shows that he did not like the film, criticizing it as another Hollywood franchise film that steals from more original films, namely Taxi Driver and the King of Comedy. Privacy Policy. | Instead of going into the cinema wanting to catch a movie about a comic book villain, audiences can watch it as a movie about a man broken by his mental illness. Web development by Ripplewerkz. Arthur's mother: And did Arthur really kill his mother in hospital? RELATED:Joaquin Phoenix's Joker: 5 Times He Was Sympathetic (And 5 Times He Went Too Far). I get that Gary was the only one who was ever nice to Arthur, so he spared him. Randall | Batman Wiki | Fandom When Arthur admitted on Murray's show that he killed the three Wall Street guys on subway why didn't he simply say it was self defense that way someone would understand how Arthur became Joker? Can someone explain what the red footprints were at the end along the corridor and then the running about at the end of the corridor? 2) Arthur's actual age isn't as old as Phoenix and he just looks that way because he's unwell and a smoker; Fleck could begin taking care of himself and be a villain for a very young Batman (depending on Canon Batman starts at 25, so if Fleck is just an old looking 35, he would be 52 when "Year One" takes place). Arthur will be an old man by the time Bruce becomes the dark knight. He instead ruthlessly murders the talk show host on live television and proceeds to address the citizens of Gotham, whipping them into a rebellious frenzy as a direct result. A contextual clue that maybe he didn't is later, Fleck didn't murder Gary (Leigh Gill) because the little person was the only clown at his workplace who was nice to him. Scan this QR code to download the app now. Also it's possible Arthur may have decided to not bother explaining why he had the gun because he felt (possibly correctly) that nobody would listen to him anyway. The police then find themselves unable to escape as clowns from all directions start grabbing them and beating them to a pulp. PS: Good question. Hes left crushed, however, when the butler labels his mother as crazy and insists she made the whole thing up due to issues with her own mental state. Going to the police might only make things worse. Its a decision that costs Arthur his beloved job as a clown and gives him even less reason to embrace the good things in life. Joker has been hailed by filmmaker Michael Moore as an instant classic, for its nods and references to past classics and its political commentary on contemporary America. So at the end of the movie, was all this Joker stuff all just a dream or a daydream in Arthur's head? He has expressed his interest in playing the Joker again stating that there is a lot more to explore with that character.But aside from him, Leonardo DiCaprio was considered by WB to play the Joker but he wasn't available at the time. Also notice that the show's director made a "cut" gesture in the background, meaning camera feed was probably cut off and somebody may have at least tried to slip out and find a phone to call the police. Is Thomas Wayne really Arthur's father, and due to his wealthy status forged adoption papers? Edit, Randall gave the gun to Arthur for money (which he intended to demand from him later). That whole scene had me on edge for some reason and it was beautifully shot. Why does Robert De Niro's character not scream for security or run off set when he realizes he is sat next to a psychopathic killer. 2) It's from all the abuse he suffered from his mothers boyfriend when he was younger. Edit, One curious fact about Joker's origins is that they're left up in the air. "I could tell you a joke, but you wouldn't get it. It is currently unknown why she let this happen, but it's presumed she was abused by him as well, causing her mental problems. (Biggest opening weekend in Singapore for NC16-rated movie ever.). Maybe what he does could be seen as less idiotic and more heroic in that light. -- One could deduce that Arthur could have fired as few as 3 or 4 rounds, with the actual incident being less dramatic than depicted. The Sophie twist puts into question just how much of the events depicted on screen are taking place inside of Arthur's head and how much are real. **It's like Ask Science, but all questions and answers are written with answers gleaned from the universe itself. What was the actual cockpit layout and crew of the Mi-24A? But maybe, if she lived, Sophie called the police about Arthur, which could be another reason why Detectives Garrity (Bill Camp) and Burke (Shea Whigham) returned to Arthur's apartment building to talk to him again. Edit, There is none. Also because there were no cameras and no reliable witnesses to confirm the identity of the suspect. This is the only time we see Joker without his make up, but the scars on his face are clearly visible. Perhaps even he wanted to end her suffering? If the document is a fake or not does not change that he would have been taken by child services for a while yet in his daydream he says he always lived with his mom as the only man of the family. This is why audiences are blown away by Joanquin Phoenix's performance -- if they watch the movie another time. Couldn't he tell the cops he killed them in self-defense? In-story, this possibly being one of Arthur's hallucinations or self-serving memories, it specifically serves to justify Arthur's increasing animosity toward him. When Arthur becomes the Joker and he calls out the horrible state of things in Gotham while on the show with Murray Franklin, Arthur could very well be speaking about present day America where people can no longer seem to communicate civilly. Copyright 2020 Mothership. No copyright infringement The Event's Origin Explained, We Still Haven't Seen Dune's Weirdest Creature, From Yoda To Huyang: The 10 Oldest Star Wars Characters. While not murdering is a positive, strangling the guy for doing his job is just plain wrong. When Arthur gets assaulted by a group of teenagers, Randall offers him a gun to defend himself, but when Arthur gets fired for possessing the weapon, Randall gives no help to him and demonstrates his true colors and gets killed by the newly turn nihilistic criminal Joker. Followed by beating him until all he can do is lay on the ground in pain. I'm pretty sure they hadn't invented VHS-recorders back then. The first time he walked down the stairs was after he got fired as a clown and packed his bag. Movies & TV Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for movie and TV enthusiasts. r/joker - One of the most intense, scary and hilarious scene in the He felt that the film was a safe corporate product made to print money instead of being challenging. The second is that he could not have reloaded the weapon while also carrying his bag in the opposite hand. Also, Arthur doesn't seem inherently unstable at first - when they meet he's just an enthusiastic fan, and based on the footage he played Arthur is just incredibly awkward and sad; it's arguably not clear until it's too late that Arthur is actually a danger. Why couldn't the police find Arthur after the subway shooting? Whenever Arthur is walking down the streets of Gotham, why does he seems to stagger a bit on one of his legs? Randall is shown to be so concerned for Arthur's well-being after he gets beaten that he gives him the firearm to defend himself. When Arthur speaks about comedy being subjective is this a knock on modern comedians and their controversial jokes and skits? Did he give the gun thinking that when Joker will be performing he will drop it - as it happened? Arthur Fleck doesnt display any more signs of wanting to get revenge on people but, when the opportunity arises, he sure as hell takes it. She turns around with an annoyed look on her face while Arthur laughs, like it's an inconvenience for her. Or as **fanlore.org** calls it [Watsonian, not a Doylist point of view](http://fanlore.org/wiki/Watsonian_vs._Doylist). Share. Did the Golden Gate Bridge 'flatten' under the weight of 300,000 people in 1987? Maybe his madness going further? Can the game be left in an invalid state if all state-based actions are replaced? Additionally Wall Street is a metaphor or metonym for rich people. Why is Joaquin Phoenix's version of Joker wearing a red suit doesn't Joker always wear purple? If 'Joker' made you feel uncomfortable, here's why Isolated, bullied and disregarded by society, Fleck begins a slow descent into madness as he transforms into the criminal mastermind known as the Joker.Fair use.\"Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for \"fair use\" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Does the fact that Penny suffered form mental illness suggest that she was Arthur's Mother and he had inherited his mental illness from her? For all we know, Arthur never shot Murray Franklin at all, and is locked up at the end for one of the many other things we see him do, or something else entirely. Interpreting non-statistically significant results: Do we have "no evidence" or "insufficient evidence" to reject the null. Arthur's counsellor who eventually cut off his access to meds, which led him spiralling downwards even further, was also a black woman -- even though it was the system that failed both her and Arthur. Murray Franklin: Murray Franklin died a very public death as it was broadcast nationwide, so it would be hard to argue that he didn't die. Since this movie takes place through Arthur's eyes, and he is shown to be a far from reliable and unbiased observer, however, one might do well to take these opinions with a grain of salt. Todd Phillips Cut Zazie Beetz 'Joker' Scene That - IndieWire Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Initially, all signs point to Joaquin Phoenixs character offing himself on live television to make a grand statement about mental illness and society, with Arthur even putting a gun to his head by a way of practice. Why are they (the three men from the subway) called the Wall Street Three when Gotham is an entirely separate city from New York? In other words: Who Arthur imagines himself to be, and how he eventually acts, finally comes together. Who is Arthur's father in the movie or comic? Through the information he saw on the medical record - and he kills her after seeing that record - it turns out that she had let him be abused and beaten up since a tender age, which would probably be the cause of his mental and physical issues. Also whenever Arthur's condition causes him to uncontrollably laugh, in the most inappropriate situations that angers people he didn't mean to offend, with it visibly distressing and physically hurting him. That line is important. He just thought he was being silly with a guy who did a silly thing. Maybe he was he still hung up about the gun. PBA occurs secondary to a neurologic disorder or brain injury. One thing I didn't quite understand in Joker was why Randall betrayed Arthur so quickly when the gun was found. Meanwhile, Murray was doing what he was best at. Edit, The film is geared to provide a more sympathetic look into who the Joker is and less towards who Thomas Wayne is, the opposite that is normally done regarding Batman's history. It doesn't tie into any other comic book or movie continuity, but is still based on the DC character. He explains that Gary's kindness didn't go unnoticed, which shows he doesn't murder indiscriminately. 2b) would be Batman starts even younger, similarly to how the show Gotham is running, with a 40-something Joker a realistic threat to a teenage Bruce. At the beginning of the film they're both shown to be good enough friends that they joke together. Edit, There's one possibility that she's always been a genuinely disturbed woman, there's another that she was basically set up by Thomas Wayne to conceal his affair, or possibly even a mixture of the two. Even though she's frightened she still acts quite nice to Arthur (offering to get his mother) and even though she could call the police, Arthur doesn't seem to be thinking that far ahead stll (he let Gary go despite every chance he'd call the cops). Did Murray intentionally mean to make fun of Arthur or no? plot explanation - Who killed the Waynes in "Joker"? - Movies & TV This would cause the nurses to come running into the room. To his horror, his conditions rears its head during a trip on the subway, where three Wall Street guys round on him and attempt to beat him to a pulp. Randall is shown to be so concerned for Arthur's well-being after he gets beaten that he gives him the firearm to defend himself. Joker (2019) - Plot - IMDb When he killed Randall, he did not kill his other colleague who was present in the room, despite the fear that he could go to the police. When the young Bruce first sees Arthur outside the wall at Wayne Manor, he slides down a pole to go to the gate. The exploration of Arthur Fleck (Joaquin Phoenix), a man disregarded by. In Joker (2019), why did Randall give the Joker the gun? (E) Unless he or his lawyer could somehow locate that woman the men were harassing and get her to come testify on his behalf, he'd have no one to testify to his claims but himself; and again, he's known to be extremely unreliable. It appears he is laughing about the death of Thomas Wayne, we see a flash of that scene again for a reason. He talked to the madman, let him have his rant, give him attention, be entertaining and engaging. He would have been separated from her as a child but, once he turned 18, if he wanted to live with his mother as soon as she was released nobody could stop that. Web design by Yu Sheng & Yu Siang. they are saying it is too violent and empty). Arthur had his signboard taken from him by a group of teens of colour, who proceeded to beat him up. Edit, Clowns are silly and Wayne though the people were silly. How to combine several legends in one frame? PS: Because if things didn't fall into place, the director would have no way to make arthur fleck the joker, and justify the name of the movie If Penny abused Arthur and was confined to Arkham, why was Arthur living with her for most of the film, wouldn't he have been separated from her by the state? plot explanation - Why did Randall give the Joker the gun? - Movies He was going to be the "joke" to everyone. He did not. The movie does not directly tie into Ledger's portrayal in "The Dark Knight" as it takes place in the 80s. Arthur all. We would like to show you a description here but the site won't allow us. But as Murray is horrified to the revelation that Arthur killed the three Wall Street guys earlier in the movie, Joker has a change of heart. Besides Phoenix himself, which other actors auditioned for the part of Fleck/Joker before Phoenix won the role? He . A sigh of relief. Edit, Maybe. 'Joker' Ending, Explained: How the Movie Connects with Batman - Thrillist Just tried to build up something that we could relate to in these days and also have something related to the comic book series.Edit: Gotham is based on Chicago and Metropolis (where Superman/Clark Kent lives) is based on New York as per the DC wiki. Edit, Yes, he smokes the American Spirit brand. Why can't the police find Arthur after the subway shooting? RELATED:Every Record Joker Has Already Broken. It is basically a scene of a child craving for warmth and affection. Phillips and co-writer Scott Silver's ending doubles down on this dilemma in the final scene, which depicts Arthur in Arkham Asylum telling a counselor she wouldn't understand why he's laughing. Sher continued, "In terms of what we did visually to play with the real and not real, there are callbacks and scenes that mirror each other. I saw Brett Cullen in this movie as Thomas Wayne and as a character in Dark knight rises. Later on, those protests turned to riots, and when one of them saw the Wayne family, he recognized Thomas and shot him and his wife. But this only serves to bring out the blandness and correctness of Murray Franklin, who as a consummate showman, also pulls off terrible one-liners. Edit, One of the mind-bending twists is that whole sections of the movie are manifestations of Arthur delusions - such as his entire relationship with his next-door neighbor Sophie.
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